David Kinnaman and Carey Nieuwhof are joined by Scott Sauls, author and senior pastor of Christ Presbyterian Church in Nashville.

Together, they discuss how the church can be countercultural for the common good in these chaotic times. And they emphasize the importance of committing to being discipled by Jesus towards humility, instead of allowing ourselves to be discipled by cable news and partisan politics.

This episode also includes the latest ChurchPulse Weekly data, which reveals that many pastors expect COVID-related disruptions to get worse in the next week. And most re-opened churches have not regained the attendance they were seeing before the pandemic.